offtopic: Digitize and record Video with A/D USB adapters
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations. In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?. Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg? And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used? Terje
Hi Terje, I have used a cheap chinese USB video grabber to digitise VHS. But I cannot remember the type. I used VLC, which worked fine, but OBS should also work. I had loaned the grabber, and have not tested if Cinelerra-GG could use it directly. I cannot remember if video and audio showed up as two different devices or not. If the audio is not a separate device, then I doubt Audacity can record with it. The quality of VHS is not that great, well below SD, I did not use a lossless format. There are several, Andrea listed some he used. But all those use very big files. I don't know about the audio quality, it is likely more than good enough for VHS. But my guess is that a motherboard's A/D is better. MatN On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 16:52:41 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_... Terje lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1... My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV. (Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder. Terje lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_...
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap. MatN On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1...
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_...
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
Ah, found some old mails back. Look at bugtrack entry 377, that dealt with an USB grabber. I think I could not get Cinelerra to put in in PAL mode. VLC worked fine. MatN On Sun, 26 Sep 2021 00:32:58 +0200 mnieuw--- via Cin <[email protected]> wrote:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1...
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_...
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
A previous article also using Easy Cap https://gordonlesti.com/digitize-a-vhs-tape-with-ffmpeg-and-easycap-on-linux... Another similar usb video converter, "Cleantt" on Amazon, mentioned as Linux compatible https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Converter-Capture-Support-Android/dp/B07QFVNS... And in another, more recent article Jancane A/D video usb adapter is rated as the best among 10 (linux not mentioned) https://geekydeck.com/best-usb-analog-video-capture/ https://www.audiointerfaces.net/jancane-usb-2-0-audio-video-converter-video-... But I haven't yet seen any a/d usb 2.0 adapter that documents something "better quality" record format than mpegs (possibly DV25) compression. What I really want is some kind of 4:2:2 sampling rate documented, like i.e DV50 or other. Neither USB 3.0 adapters is found, which possibly is neccessary for 4:2:2 FLAC lossless compression? Comments and other options or suggestions are welcome to clarify the latter :; Terje søn. 26. sep. 2021, 00:32 skrev <[email protected]>:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1...
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_...
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
On Monday, September 27, 2021, Terje J. Hanssen via Cin < [email protected]> wrote:
A previous article also using Easy Cap https://gordonlesti.com/digitize-a-vhs-tape-with- ffmpeg-and-easycap-on-linux/
Another similar usb video converter, "Cleantt" on Amazon, mentioned as Linux compatible https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Converter-Capture- Support-Android/dp/B07QFVNSYJ/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?dchild=1& keywords=free+drive+usb+video+capture+card+with+support+for+ linux&qid=1632603850&sr=8-5#immersive-view_1632603916288
And in another, more recent article Jancane A/D video usb adapter is rated as the best among 10 (linux not mentioned) https://geekydeck.com/best-usb-analog-video-capture/
https://www.audiointerfaces.net/jancane-usb-2-0-audio- video-converter-video-capture-card-digitizes-video-from-any- analog-source-including-vcr-vhs-dvd/
But I haven't yet seen any a/d usb 2.0 adapter that documents something "better quality" record format than mpegs (possibly DV25) compression.
What I really want is some kind of 4:2:2 sampling rate documented, like i.e DV50 or other. Neither USB 3.0 adapters is found, which possibly is neccessary for 4:2:2 FLAC lossless compression?
AVerMedia CE310B (Chipset: Conexant CX23888) Requires kernel version 4.19.106, 5.4.22, 5.5.6, or later. from https://wiki.raptorcs.com/wiki/POWER9_Hardware_Compatibility_List/PCIe_Devic... if you follow link to manufacturer's site it will say device support uncompressed (4:2:2) capture.. a bit more expensive (~100$) and requires pci-e slot... but cheap usb devices tend to be cheap on all fronts?
Comments and other options or suggestions are welcome to clarify the latter :;
Terje
søn. 26. sep. 2021, 00:32 skrev <[email protected]>:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_ navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1NTTKF
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/ Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_or_V.html
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
On Monday, September 27, 2021, Andrew Randrianasulu <[email protected]> wrote:
On Monday, September 27, 2021, Terje J. Hanssen via Cin < [email protected]> wrote:
A previous article also using Easy Cap https://gordonlesti.com/digitize-a-vhs-tape-with-ffmpeg-and- easycap-on-linux/
Another similar usb video converter, "Cleantt" on Amazon, mentioned as Linux compatible https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Converter-Capture-Support- Android/dp/B07QFVNSYJ/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?dchild=1&keywords= free+drive+usb+video+capture+card+with+support+for+linux& qid=1632603850&sr=8-5#immersive-view_1632603916288
And in another, more recent article Jancane A/D video usb adapter is rated as the best among 10 (linux not mentioned) https://geekydeck.com/best-usb-analog-video-capture/
https://www.audiointerfaces.net/jancane-usb-2-0-audio-video- converter-video-capture-card-digitizes-video-from-any-analo g-source-including-vcr-vhs-dvd/
But I haven't yet seen any a/d usb 2.0 adapter that documents something "better quality" record format than mpegs (possibly DV25) compression.
What I really want is some kind of 4:2:2 sampling rate documented, like i.e DV50 or other. Neither USB 3.0 adapters is found, which possibly is neccessary for 4:2:2 FLAC lossless compression?
AVerMedia CE310B (Chipset: Conexant CX23888) Requires kernel version 4.19.106, 5.4.22, 5.5.6, or later.
from
https://wiki.raptorcs.com/wiki/POWER9_Hardware_Compatibility_List/PCIe_ Devices#Video_Capture_Cards
if you follow link to manufacturer's site it will say device support uncompressed (4:2:2) capture..
a bit more expensive (~100$) and requires pci-e slot... but cheap usb devices tend to be cheap on all fronts?
also, this answer suggest old Hauppauge USB-Live 2 might work (there were problems on older kernels, you probably need to connect this device to dedicated usb bus (check with lsusb), and this requirement about initing audio capture before/at same time as video capture sounds a bit strange? ) https://superuser.com/questions/1523804/linux-usb-video-capture-issues
Comments and other options or suggestions are welcome to clarify the latter :;
Terje
søn. 26. sep. 2021, 00:32 skrev <[email protected]>:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_ g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1NTTKF
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfe r_VHS_DVD_Media_or_V.html
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
I just plugged in my UCA202, and the system (Mint 20.2 XFCE) immediately recognized it. It shows up in the audio mixer (pavucontrol) as an extra input device and extra output device, both as "PCM2902 Audio Codec Analog Stereo". Output from CinGG goes fine, as soon as plug it in, audio out switches to the UCA202 instead of line out. For input, he only source I have currently has low output level (-15 dB), but I see signal coming in in the audio mixer "input devices" tab. This could be because line in normally is 1V for 0dB, and the old aux in on audio equipment was 100 mV. As ALSA input device it shows here up in CinGG's recording setting as "USB Audio CODEC #0". But you must use PulseAudio for recording, else it was very intermittent (and CinGG with ALSA config tab doesn't recognise the device has gone if you unplug it). I set up CinGG to record audio only/create resource only, but recording is not always OK with ALSA. I could get a properly recorded file once, other times not. With PulseASudio it worked fine. The audio mixer should show recording programs too and it did only if CinGG was set to PulseAudio. Also, with Alsa, CinGG's terminal shows a write buffer error each 2048 samples if you enable "monitor audio" so there might be something wrong there (bug), and I did not see the audio, also not on the audio meter window. With PulseAudio it was Ok again. These might be bugs in CinGG, but anyway, use PulseAudi for audio recording and you should be fine. MatN
Excuse my smartphone typing: Hu Andrew wrote:
AVerMedia CE310B (Chipset: Conexant CX23888) Requires kernel version 4.19.106, 5.4.22, 5.5.6, or later.
from
https://wiki.raptorcs.com/wiki/POWER9_Hardware_Compatibility_List/PCIe_Devic...
if you follow link to manufacturer's site it will say device support uncompressed (4:2:2) capture..
a bit more expensive (~100$) and requires pci-e slot... but cheap usb devices tend to be cheap on all fronts.
Yes, AVerMedia CE310B looks very interesting as a dedicated SD capture card for analog composite and S-Video. It also looks to come at a more affordable price than the somewhat similar Blackmagic Decklink cards and SDK that I posted a request for on the Cin forum previously https://www.cinelerra-gg.org/it/forum/forum-hardware/declink-video-capture-a... I think there also is space for a PCIe on my workstations mobo, MSI Z170A/Skylake-i7. My current Leap 15.3 includes kernel 5.3.18. Optional my dualboot Tumbleweed currently looks to come with kernel 5.14.5/5.14.6. But, there is always a but, so excuse my questions ;) Reading the CE310B description, specs an datasheet, I noticed the following points: Q1) Linux driver coming soon? Q2) SDK download useable for Linux? Q3) With Linux V4L2 framework it supports "third party software". What about typical free video tools and software on Linux like VLC, OBS, ffmpeg and CGG? Q4) CE310B support uncompressed AVI or WMV format which are MS Windows propriary format. What about Linux options here to i.e pipe uncompressed 422 video via FLAC lossless compression ? Thanks, Terje man. 27. sep. 2021, 13:50 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
A previous article also using Easy Cap
https://gordonlesti.com/digitize-a-vhs-tape-with-ffmpeg-and-easycap-on-linux...
Another similar usb video converter, "Cleantt" on Amazon, mentioned as Linux compatible
https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Converter-Capture-Support-Android/dp/B07QFVNS...
And in another, more recent article Jancane A/D video usb adapter is rated as the best among 10 (linux not mentioned) https://geekydeck.com/best-usb-analog-video-capture/
https://www.audiointerfaces.net/jancane-usb-2-0-audio-video-converter-video-...
But I haven't yet seen any a/d usb 2.0 adapter that documents something "better quality" record format than mpegs (possibly DV25) compression.
What I really want is some kind of 4:2:2 sampling rate documented, like i.e DV50 or other. Neither USB 3.0 adapters is found, which possibly is neccessary for 4:2:2 FLAC lossless compression?
Comments and other options or suggestions are welcome to clarify the latter :;
Terje
søn. 26. sep. 2021, 00:32 skrev <[email protected]>:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1...
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_...
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
On Tuesday, September 28, 2021, Terje J. Hanssen via Cin < [email protected]> wrote:
Excuse my smartphone typing: Hu Andrew wrote:
AVerMedia CE310B (Chipset: Conexant CX23888) Requires kernel version 4.19.106, 5.4.22, 5.5.6, or later.
from
https://wiki.raptorcs.com/wiki/POWER9_Hardware_Compatibility_List/PCIe_Devic...
if you follow link to manufacturer's site it will say device support uncompressed (4:2:2) capture..
a bit more expensive (~100$) and requires pci-e slot... but cheap usb devices tend to be cheap on all fronts.
Yes, AVerMedia CE310B looks very interesting as a dedicated SD capture card for analog composite and S-Video.
It also looks to come at a more affordable price than the somewhat similar Blackmagic Decklink cards and SDK that I posted a request for on the Cin forum previously
https://www.cinelerra-gg.org/it/forum/forum-hardware/declink-video-capture-a...
I think there also is space for a PCIe on my workstations mobo, MSI Z170A/Skylake-i7.
My current Leap 15.3 includes kernel 5.3.18. Optional my dualboot Tumbleweed currently looks to come with kernel 5.14.5/5.14.6.
But, there is always a but, so excuse my questions ;)
Reading the CE310B description, specs an datasheet, I noticed the following points:
Q1)
Linux driver coming soon?
I think linux driver was already around, but specific card was not in mainline kernel:
media: cx23885: Add support for AVerMedia CE310B [ Upstream commit dc4cac67e13515835ed8081d510aa507aacb013b ] The AVerMedia CE310B is a simple composite + S-Video + stereo audio capture card, and uses only the CX23888 to perform all of these functions. I've tested both video inputs and the audio interface and confirmed that they're all working. However, there are some issues: * Sometimes when I switch inputs the video signal turns black and can't be recovered until the system is rebooted. I haven't been able to determine the cause of this behavior, nor have I found a solution to fix it or any workarounds other than rebooting. * The card sometimes seems to have trouble syncing to the video signal, and some of the VBI data appears as noise at the top of the frame, but I assume that to be a result of my very noisy RF environment and the card's unshielded input traces rather than a configuration issue. https://mirrors.edge.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v5.x/ChangeLog-5.5.6 ---
Q2)
SDK download useable for Linux?
not tried, by default their website blocked in my country, and VPN a bit sloooow..
Q3)
With Linux V4L2 framework it supports "third party software". What about typical free video tools and software on Linux like VLC, OBS, ffmpeg and CGG?
well, only practice may tell... sorry. (I will continue to look around for more info)
Q4)
CE310B support uncompressed AVI or WMV format which are MS Windows propriary format. What about Linux options here to i.e pipe uncompressed 422 video via FLAC lossless compression ?
FLAC is audio codec, but from what I saw ppl used it with huffyuv for example on Windows, so main output from drivr should be uncompressed
Thanks,
Terje
man. 27. sep. 2021, 13:50 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
A previous article also using Easy Cap https://gordonlesti.com/digitize-a-vhs-tape-with- ffmpeg-and-easycap-on-linux/
Another similar usb video converter, "Cleantt" on Amazon, mentioned as Linux compatible https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Converter-Capture- Support-Android/dp/B07QFVNSYJ/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?dchild=1& keywords=free+drive+usb+video+capture+card+with+support+for+ linux&qid=1632603850&sr=8-5#immersive-view_1632603916288
And in another, more recent article Jancane A/D video usb adapter is rated as the best among 10 (linux not mentioned) https://geekydeck.com/best-usb-analog-video-capture/
https://www.audiointerfaces.net/jancane-usb-2-0-audio- video-converter-video-capture-card-digitizes-video-from-any- analog-source-including-vcr-vhs-dvd/
But I haven't yet seen any a/d usb 2.0 adapter that documents something "better quality" record format than mpegs (possibly DV25) compression.
What I really want is some kind of 4:2:2 sampling rate documented, like i.e DV50 or other. Neither USB 3.0 adapters is found, which possibly is neccessary for 4:2:2 FLAC lossless compression?
Comments and other options or suggestions are welcome to clarify the latter :;
Terje
søn. 26. sep. 2021, 00:32 skrev <[email protected]>:
Yep, something like that, I think the make I used was Easycap.
MatN
On Sat, 25 Sep 2021 23:26:27 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
Something like this? USB 2.0 Audio/Video Converter - Digitize and Edit Video from Any Analog Source Including VCR, VHS, DVD https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XJKSJZ8/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_ navT_g_DYWFFDKH9ZJY6G1NTTKF
My tape sources are Hi8 and S-VHS, that is S-Video quality between VHS and DV.
(Also I backed up some music from my old reel tape recorder to "HiFi" HQ VHS tapes 20 years ago). Og And I got a working Sony Hi8 tape deck and a Panasonic S-VHS deck on eBay a few years ago, as players beside my still working Sony Hi8 camcorder.
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 21:37 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]>:
Nothing would be better than if this can be done via Cin-gg
https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/ Transfer_VHS_DVD_Media_or_V.html
Terje
lør. 25. sep. 2021, 16:52 skrev Terje J. Hanssen <[email protected]
:
Although I have and have used some Black Magic external tools for this, I'm also interested in simple and low cost options for Linux workstations.
In a recent article the Augustin VGB100 usb2.0 video adaper and VLC was used to record video https://www.arsouyes.org/en/blog/2021/2021-05-17_Numerisation_VHS
Any experience here with similar A/D video adapters, quality and applications for recording on Linux?.
Second I wonder if some lossless, compressed master video format is available for better quality before final converting with typical ffmeg?
And third, maybe a stupid question: Is it possible to record just Audio with an A/D Video adapter, which audio record format and what quality, compared with a pure Audio adapter? And if so, can audio record applications like Audiacity be used?
Terje
Hi Terje, - I would avoid plug-in cards, you are completely dependent on the manufacturer's support for Linux drivers. On the other hand, USB grabbers usually follow standard USB audio/video rules, and almost always work. - You want grabbing in uncompressed 4:2:2 format (4:4:4 does not make much sense for PAL), the datastream is no problem for even USB2 . - CinGG did not work with my then Easycap grabber, because it could not switch it to PAL, and the default after plugging it in was NTSC. However, this was a bug in CinGG, VLC worked fine with the same device. I did some work on it but never finished it, lack of time. MatN
On Tuesday, September 28, 2021 12:47:17 PM CEST, mnieuw--- via Cin wrote:
- I would avoid plug-in cards, you are completely dependent on the manufacturer's support for Linux drivers. On the other hand, USB grabbers usually follow standard USB audio/video rules, and almost always work.
Your argument is valid for drivers in Linux. The problem with the USB drivers and Linux; - Linux supports a single endpoint per device, when the device needs two independent drivers this causes a problem. For example V4L + libusb with an ATEM.
- You want grabbing in uncompressed 4:2:2 format (4:4:4 does not make much sense for PAL), the datastream is no problem for even USB2 .
- The bus speed can be saturated - ISO transport is notoriously bad I own a very great audio device (YellowTec Puc2) works very well, but I would not connect it to a system with a shared USB bus.
- CinGG did not work with my then Easycap grabber, because it could not switch it to PAL, and the default after plugging it in was NTSC. However, this was a bug in CinGG, VLC worked fine with the same device. I did some work on it but never finished it, lack of time.
v4l2-ctl to the rescue :) -- Stefan
Mat and all I take a follow-up included below: Den 25.09.2021 20:47, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
Hi Terje, I have used a cheap chinese USB video grabber to digitise VHS. But I cannot remember the type. I used VLC, which worked fine, but OBS should also work. I had loaned the grabber, and have not tested if Cinelerra-GG could use it directly. I cannot remember if video and audio showed up as two different devices or not. If the audio is not a separate device, then I doubt Audacity can record with it.
The quality of VHS is not that great, well below SD, I did not use a lossless format. There are several, Andrea listed some he used. But all those use very big files.
If available, it could be of interest to get mediainfo output for the format you grabbed? I would be surprised if the Chroma subsampling was better than 4:2:0 (like PAL DV, about 29 Mb/s) The lossless format mentioned, were they grabbed with another capture device? I myself did some ProRes 422 HQ (SD) recorded at 80 Mb/s overall bitrate.
I don't know about the audio quality, it is likely more than good enough for VHS. But my guess is that a motherboard's A/D is better.
Den 26.09.2021 09:05, skrev mat via Cin:
Terje,
I found out which USB grabber I was using. It was the Basetech EasyCap BT116; the same device might well have been sold under a different name. On Windows, VLC gave a lot of errors, but OBS handled it fine. It only handled standard SD format, not HD, so output is alwasy 4:3 .
But for me using Linux Mint, it worked with VLC, but not Cinelerra.
It seems that Basetech EasyCap BT116 was not on the LinuxTVWiki list (2016) https://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Easycap Den 28.09.2021 12:47, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
Hi Terje,
- I would avoid plug-in cards, you are completely dependent on the manufacturer's support for Linux drivers. On the other hand, USB grabbers usually follow standard USB audio/video rules, and almost always work. - You want grabbing in uncompressed 4:2:2 format (4:4:4 does not make much sense for PAL), the datastream is no problem for even USB2 . - CinGG did not work with my then Easycap grabber, because it could not switch it to PAL, and the default after plugging it in was NTSC. However, this was a bug in CinGG, VLC worked fine with the same device. I did some work on it but never finished it, lack of time.
MatN
I've also got confirmed from AVerMedia that their CU511B USB3 (full HD) box mentioned just has been EOLed. Their only current solution with Linux driver (for Ubuntu) seems to be CL311M2 (full HD), which again is a PCIe grabber card. Terje J. H https://www.avermedia.com/professional/download/cl311_m2#ans_part
On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 18:41:35 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
If available, it could be of interest to get mediainfo output for the format you grabbed? I would be surprised if the Chroma subsampling was better than 4:2:0 (like PAL DV, about 29 Mb/s)
I don't know the format, VLC grabbed it and I had it saved as MP4.
It seems that Basetech EasyCap BT116 was not on the LinuxTVWiki list (2016) https://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Easycap
Maybe, but sometimes the same device by name has a different inside. It worked on Linux with VLC.
I've also got confirmed from AVerMedia that their CU511B USB3 (full HD) box mentioned just has been EOLed. Their only current solution with Linux driver (for Ubuntu) seems to be CL311M2 (full HD), which again is a PCIe grabber card.
There are also USB HDMI video grabbers, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fltt5JhodCE (don't have any experience with those). But the german c't IT magazine has tested a number of cheap ones, see https://www.heise.de/tests/HDMI-USB-Videograbber-mit-Full-HD-Aufloesung-ab-7... . If you are interested, I can lookup the article. Mat
On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 21:47:48 +0200 <[email protected]> wrote:
On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 18:41:35 +0200 "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> wrote:
If available, it could be of interest to get mediainfo output for the format you grabbed? I would be surprised if the Chroma subsampling was better than 4:2:0 (like PAL DV, about 29 Mb/s)
I don't know the format, VLC grabbed it and I had it saved as MP4.
It seems that Basetech EasyCap BT116 was not on the LinuxTVWiki list (2016) https://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Easycap
Maybe, but sometimes the same device by name has a different inside. It worked on Linux with VLC.
I've also got confirmed from AVerMedia that their CU511B USB3 (full HD) box mentioned just has been EOLed. Their only current solution with Linux driver (for Ubuntu) seems to be CL311M2 (full HD), which again is a PCIe grabber card.
There are also USB HDMI video grabbers, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fltt5JhodCE (don't have any experience with those). But the german c't IT magazine has tested a number of cheap ones, see https://www.heise.de/tests/HDMI-USB-Videograbber-mit-Full-HD-Aufloesung-ab-7... . If you are interested, I can lookup the article.
Mat
c't tested it successfully under Ubunto 20.04 . The devices implement box-standard UVC (USB Video Class) and UAC (USB Audio Class). Linux kernels 4.5 and later should be OK. MatN
Den 11.10.2021 21:51, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
snip
I've also got confirmed from AVerMedia that their CU511B USB3 (full HD) box mentioned just has been EOLed. Their only current solution with Linux driver (for Ubuntu) seems to be CL311M2 (full HD), which again is a PCIe grabber card. There are also USB HDMI video grabbers, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fltt5JhodCE (don't have any experience with those). But the german c't IT magazine has tested a number of cheap ones, see https://www.heise.de/tests/HDMI-USB-Videograbber-mit-Full-HD-Aufloesung-ab-7... . If you are interested, I can lookup the article.
Mat c't tested it successfully under Ubunto 20.04 . The devices implement box-standard UVC (USB Video Class) and UAC (USB Audio Class). Linux kernels 4.5 and later should be OK.
MatN
Yes, I've seen simple HDMI to USB video grabbers. But isn't these only digital to digital video without A/D converter, which for me is the most central part? Then it would be fine to get both HDMI and SD combined in a single device, like in the above more complex and costly AVerMedia device or also BM Declink, both with some HDMI (breakout) cable dongle for analog connections. Terje J. H
Le Mon, 11 Oct 2021 18:41:35 +0200, "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> a écrit :
Mat and all
I take a follow-up included below:
Den 25.09.2021 20:47, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
Hi Terje, I have used a cheap chinese USB video grabber to digitise VHS. But I cannot remember the type. I used VLC, which worked fine, but OBS should also work. I had loaned the grabber, and have not tested if Cinelerra-GG could use it directly. I cannot remember if video and audio showed up as two different devices or not. If the audio is not a separate device, then I doubt Audacity can record with it.
Hi, On linux, you can use mencoder to grab audio + video and specify any video input and output file and format you want to use. It is much more easier to use than ffmpeg. Something like: DSVID="/dev/video0" NORM="PAL-BG" SVID="2" # the input on the video device ALSA_SVID="hw.1" # the ALSA card RATE="48000" # [Hz] same than the sound card for best quality WIDTH="634" # must be divisible by 16 HEIGHT="472" # must be divisible by 16 VRATE="4500" # [kbits] between 4 (small file) and 16000 (big file) CROPED_WIDTH="628" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_HEIGHT="448" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_X="6" CROPED_Y="16" F_SV_REC="/home/dom/movie.avi" mencoder tv:// -tv driver=v4l2:device=$DSVID:norm=$NORM:input=$SVID:alsa:adevice=$ALSA_SVID:audiorate=$RATE:width=$WIDTH:height=$HEIGHT -mc 0 -noskip -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg4:vbitrate=$VRATE -vf crop=$CROPED_WIDTH:$CROPED_HEIGHT:$CROPED_X:$CROPED_Y,pp=lb -oac mp3lame -lameopts cbr:br=64 -o $F_SV_REC" For the video quality of VHS, if the player or the video camera have a s-video output, and the video card a s-video input, the final record will be better than with "standard" VHS quality. Cheers, Dominique
Den 11.10.2021 22:28, skrev Dominique Michel via Cin:
Le Mon, 11 Oct 2021 18:41:35 +0200, "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> a écrit :
Mat and all
I take a follow-up included below:
Den 25.09.2021 20:47, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
Hi Terje, I have used a cheap chinese USB video grabber to digitise VHS. But I cannot remember the type. I used VLC, which worked fine, but OBS should also work. I had loaned the grabber, and have not tested if Cinelerra-GG could use it directly. I cannot remember if video and audio showed up as two different devices or not. If the audio is not a separate device, then I doubt Audacity can record with it. Hi, On linux, you can use mencoder to grab audio + video and specify any video input and output file and format you want to use. It is much more easier to use than ffmpeg. Something like:
DSVID="/dev/video0" NORM="PAL-BG" SVID="2" # the input on the video device ALSA_SVID="hw.1" # the ALSA card RATE="48000" # [Hz] same than the sound card for best quality WIDTH="634" # must be divisible by 16 HEIGHT="472" # must be divisible by 16 VRATE="4500" # [kbits] between 4 (small file) and 16000 (big file) CROPED_WIDTH="628" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_HEIGHT="448" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_X="6" CROPED_Y="16" F_SV_REC="/home/dom/movie.avi"
mencoder tv:// -tv driver=v4l2:device=$DSVID:norm=$NORM:input=$SVID:alsa:adevice=$ALSA_SVID:audiorate=$RATE:width=$WIDTH:height=$HEIGHT -mc 0 -noskip -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg4:vbitrate=$VRATE -vf crop=$CROPED_WIDTH:$CROPED_HEIGHT:$CROPED_X:$CROPED_Y,pp=lb -oac mp3lame -lameopts cbr:br=64 -o $F_SV_REC"
For the video quality of VHS, if the player or the video camera have a s-video output, and the video card a s-video input, the final record will be better than with "standard" VHS quality.
Cheers, Dominique
Interesting about Mencoder, but sorry - there is no S-Video IN port on my video card inxi -Fzx | grep Graphics Graphics: Device-1: NVIDIA GK208B [GeForce GT 730] vendor: ASUSTeK driver: nouveau v: kernel bus ID: 01:00.0 Terje J. H
Le Tue, 12 Oct 2021 00:09:38 +0200, "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> a écrit :
Den 11.10.2021 22:28, skrev Dominique Michel via Cin:
Le Mon, 11 Oct 2021 18:41:35 +0200, "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> a écrit :
Mat and all
I take a follow-up included below:
Den 25.09.2021 20:47, skrev mnieuw--- via Cin:
Hi Terje, I have used a cheap chinese USB video grabber to digitise VHS. But I cannot remember the type. I used VLC, which worked fine, but OBS should also work. I had loaned the grabber, and have not tested if Cinelerra-GG could use it directly. I cannot remember if video and audio showed up as two different devices or not. If the audio is not a separate device, then I doubt Audacity can record with it. Hi, On linux, you can use mencoder to grab audio + video and specify any video input and output file and format you want to use. It is much more easier to use than ffmpeg. Something like:
DSVID="/dev/video0" NORM="PAL-BG" SVID="2" # the input on the video device ALSA_SVID="hw.1" # the ALSA card RATE="48000" # [Hz] same than the sound card for best quality WIDTH="634" # must be divisible by 16 HEIGHT="472" # must be divisible by 16 VRATE="4500" # [kbits] between 4 (small file) and 16000 (big file) CROPED_WIDTH="628" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_HEIGHT="448" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_X="6" CROPED_Y="16" F_SV_REC="/home/dom/movie.avi"
mencoder tv:// -tv driver=v4l2:device=$DSVID:norm=$NORM:input=$SVID:alsa:adevice=$ALSA_SVID:audiorate=$RATE:width=$WIDTH:height=$HEIGHT -mc 0 -noskip -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg4:vbitrate=$VRATE -vf crop=$CROPED_WIDTH:$CROPED_HEIGHT:$CROPED_X:$CROPED_Y,pp=lb -oac mp3lame -lameopts cbr:br=64 -o $F_SV_REC"
For the video quality of VHS, if the player or the video camera have a s-video output, and the video card a s-video input, the final record will be better than with "standard" VHS quality.
Cheers, Dominique
Interesting about Mencoder, but sorry - there is no S-Video IN port on my video card
inxi -Fzx | grep Graphics Graphics: Device-1: NVIDIA GK208B [GeForce GT 730] vendor: ASUSTeK driver: nouveau v: kernel bus ID: 01:00.0
This is your video output port, not the input one.
Terje J. H
Den 13.10.2021 11:25, skrev Dominique Michel via Cin:
Le Tue, 12 Oct 2021 00:09:38 +0200, "Terje J. Hanssen via Cin" <[email protected]> a écrit :
Den 11.10.2021 22:28, skrev Dominique Michel via Cin:
Hi, On linux, you can use mencoder to grab audio + video and specify any video input and output file and format you want to use. It is much more easier to use than ffmpeg. Something like:
DSVID="/dev/video0" NORM="PAL-BG" SVID="2" # the input on the video device ALSA_SVID="hw.1" # the ALSA card RATE="48000" # [Hz] same than the sound card for best quality WIDTH="634" # must be divisible by 16 HEIGHT="472" # must be divisible by 16 VRATE="4500" # [kbits] between 4 (small file) and 16000 (big file) CROPED_WIDTH="628" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_HEIGHT="448" # must be divisible by 16 or 4 CROPED_X="6" CROPED_Y="16" F_SV_REC="/home/dom/movie.avi"
mencoder tv:// -tv driver=v4l2:device=$DSVID:norm=$NORM:input=$SVID:alsa:adevice=$ALSA_SVID:audiorate=$RATE:width=$WIDTH:height=$HEIGHT -mc 0 -noskip -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg4:vbitrate=$VRATE -vf crop=$CROPED_WIDTH:$CROPED_HEIGHT:$CROPED_X:$CROPED_Y,pp=lb -oac mp3lame -lameopts cbr:br=64 -o $F_SV_REC"
For the video quality of VHS, if the player or the video camera have a s-video output, and the video card a s-video input, the final record will be better than with "standard" VHS quality.
Cheers, Dominique Interesting about Mencoder, but sorry - there is no S-Video IN port on my video card
inxi -Fzx | grep Graphics Graphics: Device-1: NVIDIA GK208B [GeForce GT 730] vendor: ASUSTeK driver: nouveau v: kernel bus ID: 01:00.0 This is your video output port, not the input one. Yes, the purpose was to show the name of the video card; NVIDIA GeForce GT 730. According to its specs it has 3 output ports: DVI, HDMI, VGA
I also verified that the video card, GeForce GTX 960, on my second workstation (Supermicro) also has only output ports. (In the past I had workstation(s) with analog I/O ports/ S-video, which also was the case on the old video capture card Pinnacle DV500 for Windows). Terje J. H
Many good points, and I shorten the repeated thread above .................... @Andrew First
FLAC is audio codec, but from what I saw ppl used it with huffyuv for example on Windows, so main output from drivr should be uncompressed
Of course, my confusion, FLAC is "Free Lossless Audio Codec", which I never have used so far (remembered Andrea mentioned it). Could i.e free, lossless FFV1 (or x265 lossless) be useful "LTS and crossplatform compatible codecs" to compress 4:2:2 SD and HD video output for archiving and editing? So far I have used proprietary ProRes HQ via BM Hyperdeck Shuttle 2, but an open format is a wishible option. (Playback S-Video via TBC and converted to DV PAL (4:2:0) has visible less colors, which also may be due to Datavideo bult-in the A/D converter in the recorder..) 1) AVerMedia CE310B This PCIe videograbber is possibly"End Of Life - This product is no longer available to purchase" https://www.scan.co.uk/products/avermedia-ce310b-pcie-frame-grabber-with-com... 2) AVerMedia CL311-M2 This looks to be a newer, more professional and > US $300 costly PCIe video capture card that supports both analog video, full HD(MI) video and more. Beyond Windows support, there is a Linux Driver (2.0.8) for Ubuntu 20.04/18.04/16.04, kernel 5.4.0-4.15.0, TegraOS kernel 4.4.0, Support users to complie driver by themselves. While the first CL311-M1 included a S-Video connector on its backplane, the M2 version apply a cable dongle and supports 8 bit colors, 4:2:2 uncompressed format.. (That is, not unlike BM's (previous) Intensity Pro video grabber card) https://professional.avermedia.com/frame-grabbers/cl311-m2/ https://www.avermedia.com/professional/download/cl311_m2#ans_part https://www.avermedia.com/professional/faqs/cl311_m2 https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/sdk/overview https://www.amazon.com/AVerMedia-1080P-60FPS-Capture-CL311-M2/dp/B07B9YHWS9 @Mat and @Stefan
- I would avoid plug-in cards, you are completely dependent on the manufacturer's support for Linux drivers. On the other hand, USB grabbers usually follow standard USB audio/video rules, and almost always work.
Your argument is valid for drivers in Linux. The problem with the USB drivers and Linux; - Linux supports a single endpoint per device, when the device needs two independent drivers this causes a problem. For example V4L + libusb with an ATEM.
3) AVerMedia CU511B This full HD and SD Capture Box, 8 bit 4:2:2 with USB 3.0, could possibly be an interesting external counterpart to the CE311-M2 PCIe capture card mentioned above. However I would expect it costs at least as much; possibly therefore my search didn't find it for sail. According to the latest datasheet (DS_CU511B_EN_21060630.pdf, 1.5 MB), Windows and Linux driver support is included (and possibly required?) as •Linux Services •Support Linux kernel 2.6.14 version and later based on V4L2 & ALSA framework •Driver customization service by request https://www.avermedia.com/professional/news/20 https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/cu511b/overview https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/cu511b/spec https://www.avermedia.com/professional/faqs/cu511b http://storage.avermedia.com/web_release_www/CU511B/DS_CU511B_EN_21060630.pd... --------- Terje
Den 30.09.2021 00:47, skrev Terje J. Hanssen:
Many good points, and I shorten the repeated thread above ....................
@Andrew
First
FLAC is audio codec, but from what I saw ppl used it with huffyuv for example on Windows, so main output from drivr should be uncompressed
Of course, my confusion, FLAC is "Free Lossless Audio Codec", which I never have used so far (remembered Andrea mentioned it).
And to correct myself: Andrea mentioned *FFV1* in a previous forum post https://www.cinelerra-gg.org/forum/postid/1289/ Terje
Could i.e free, lossless FFV1 (or x265 lossless) be useful "LTS and crossplatform compatible codecs" to compress 4:2:2 SD and HD video output for archiving and editing? So far I have used proprietary ProRes HQ via BM Hyperdeck Shuttle 2, but an open format is a wishible option. (Playback S-Video via TBC and converted to DV PAL (4:2:0) has visible less colors, which also may be due to Datavideo bult-in the A/D converter in the recorder..)
1) AVerMedia CE310B This PCIe videograbber is possibly"End Of Life - This product is no longer available to purchase" https://www.scan.co.uk/products/avermedia-ce310b-pcie-frame-grabber-with-com...
2) AVerMedia CL311-M2 This looks to be a newer, more professional and > US $300 costly PCIe video capture card that supports both analog video, full HD(MI) video and more. Beyond Windows support, there is a Linux Driver (2.0.8) for Ubuntu 20.04/18.04/16.04, kernel 5.4.0-4.15.0, TegraOS kernel 4.4.0, Support users to complie driver by themselves. While the first CL311-M1 included a S-Video connector on its backplane, the M2 version apply a cable dongle and supports 8 bit colors, 4:2:2 uncompressed format.. (That is, not unlike BM's (previous) Intensity Pro video grabber card)
https://professional.avermedia.com/frame-grabbers/cl311-m2/ https://www.avermedia.com/professional/download/cl311_m2#ans_part https://www.avermedia.com/professional/faqs/cl311_m2 https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/sdk/overview https://www.amazon.com/AVerMedia-1080P-60FPS-Capture-CL311-M2/dp/B07B9YHWS9
@Mat and @Stefan
- I would avoid plug-in cards, you are completely dependent on the manufacturer's support for Linux drivers. On the other hand, USB grabbers usually follow standard USB audio/video rules, and almost always work.
Your argument is valid for drivers in Linux. The problem with the USB drivers and Linux; - Linux supports a single endpoint per device, when the device needs two independent drivers this causes a problem. For example V4L + libusb with an ATEM.
3) AVerMedia CU511B This full HD and SD Capture Box, 8 bit 4:2:2 with USB 3.0, could possibly be an interesting external counterpart to the CE311-M2 PCIe capture card mentioned above. However I would expect it costs at least as much; possibly therefore my search didn't find it for sail. According to the latest datasheet (DS_CU511B_EN_21060630.pdf, 1.5 MB), Windows and Linux driver support is included (and possibly required?) as •Linux Services •Support Linux kernel 2.6.14 version and later based on V4L2 & ALSA framework •Driver customization service by request
https://www.avermedia.com/professional/news/20 https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/cu511b/overview https://www.avermedia.com/professional/product/cu511b/spec https://www.avermedia.com/professional/faqs/cu511b http://storage.avermedia.com/web_release_www/CU511B/DS_CU511B_EN_21060630.pd...
--------- Terje
Hello people, first time I'm writing here and not native English speaker. So forgive me if I'm not that good at expressing myself. That said I want to share the content of an article I read somewhere that (unfortunately) I do not remember anymore but I remember the guts of if and think it could be much useful for someone. The writer tested a lot of (not so) inexpensive PAL/NTSC USB and PCI converters and a few of expensive ones too. Suddenly he remembered that its Digital TV with PAL/NTSC input was _much_ better at displaying video that the video grabbers. To make a long story short he discovered that that was because of an internal analog to digital _and_ the FHD to HD digital downconverter that did the trick. The principle here is "always sample much more that what you want to obtain". The result is this: forget the explensive and inexpensive grabbers and buy: - one cheap HDMI to USB3 grabber (you can find models compatible with linux for ~10-20 euros / dollars) - one cheap PAL/NTSC (SCART) to HDMI converter (you can find models for ~10 euros/dollars) and that's all. It will also come handy for aquisition of video from reflex/mirrorless cameras and so on... Hope someone find this handy... -- Saluton, Marco Ciampa
Den 11.10.2021 22:41, skrev Marco Ciampa via Cin:
Hello people, first time I'm writing here and not native English speaker. So forgive me if I'm not that good at expressing myself.
That said I want to share the content of an article I read somewhere that (unfortunately) I do not remember anymore but I remember the guts of if and think it could be much useful for someone.
The writer tested a lot of (not so) inexpensive PAL/NTSC USB and PCI converters and a few of expensive ones too. Suddenly he remembered that its Digital TV with PAL/NTSC input was _much_ better at displaying video that the video grabbers. To make a long story short he discovered that that was because of an internal analog to digital _and_ the FHD to HD digital downconverter that did the trick. The principle here is "always sample much more that what you want to obtain".
The result is this: forget the explensive and inexpensive grabbers and buy:
- one cheap HDMI to USB3 grabber (you can find models compatible with linux for ~10-20 euros / dollars)
- one cheap PAL/NTSC (SCART) to HDMI converter (you can find models for ~10 euros/dollars)
and that's all. It will also come handy for aquisition of video from reflex/mirrorless cameras and so on...
Hope someone find this handy...
--
Saluton, Marco Ciampa
This looks like a captivating, simple solution, if and when everything work. What I think I've read previous, is that playback of interlaced video looks better on Televisions than on PC displays. 1. My TV has built-in ports for analog video playback (S-Video and RCA/Phono), beside additional SCART and HDMI ports 2. If I understand your description right, the HDMI to USB3 grabber should be used to record from a TV HDMI port to a Linux PC? While my HDV camera supports HDMI video out, I wonder if TV HDMI ports do that as I have really never tested it. (At least my HD PVRK could not record HDTV via the HDMI cable, only a limited format from the antenna cable. Analog VCR could record SD video via SCART or S-video adapter) 3. If HDMI video out works, what type of digital signal is expected (format uncompressed and chroma level?)? And if works, it has to be recorded as compressed (lossless) on the Linux PC? Among other 4:3 aspect ratio from analog SD video has to be taken care of. Terje J. H
On Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 01:24:43AM +0200, Terje J. Hanssen via Cin wrote:
Den 11.10.2021 22:41, skrev Marco Ciampa via Cin:
Hello people, first time I'm writing here and not native English speaker. So forgive me if I'm not that good at expressing myself.
That said I want to share the content of an article I read somewhere that (unfortunately) I do not remember anymore but I remember the guts of if and think it could be much useful for someone.
The writer tested a lot of (not so) inexpensive PAL/NTSC USB and PCI converters and a few of expensive ones too. Suddenly he remembered that its Digital TV with PAL/NTSC input was _much_ better at displaying video that the video grabbers. To make a long story short he discovered that that was because of an internal analog to digital _and_ the FHD to HD digital downconverter that did the trick. The principle here is "always sample much more that what you want to obtain".
The result is this: forget the explensive and inexpensive grabbers and buy:
- one cheap HDMI to USB3 grabber (you can find models compatible with linux for ~10-20 euros / dollars)
- one cheap PAL/NTSC (SCART) to HDMI converter (you can find models for ~10 euros/dollars)
and that's all. It will also come handy for aquisition of video from reflex/mirrorless cameras and so on...
Hope someone find this handy...
--
Saluton, Marco Ciampa
This looks like a captivating, simple solution, if and when everything work. What I think I've read previous, is that playback of interlaced video looks better on Televisions than on PC displays.
1. My TV has built-in ports for analog video playback (S-Video and RCA/Phono), beside additional SCART and HDMI ports
Yes but unfortunately these are _inputs_ and cannot be used for conversion from analog video to digital video. The converter is _inside_ the TV and unfortunately, you cannot use it. But the thing is that chip is very inexpensive and you can find it in SCART to HDMI converters.
2. If I understand your description right, the HDMI to USB3 grabber should be used to record from a TV HDMI port to a Linux PC?
No. The HDMI to USB3 must be feeded by a cheap (but effective) analog to digital converter. The thing is: the analog to digital converters _and_ the digital grabbers inside cheap pal/ntsc to usb2 are a crap. If you want a really good quality conversion you have to open wide your wallet and buy a really expensive grabber just to be sure that it has inside a good (but not so expensive in itself) analog to digital converter. ... or use a cheap external one like this (just an example): https://www.amazon.com/ZHIYUEN-Adapter-Universal-Converter-Consumption/dp/B0... and to capture use one of these: https://www.amazon.com/IPXOZO-Video-Capture-Card-USB/dp/B08YRWB7VD these are just examples, (I do not work for Amazon! ;-) I picked them randomly and they _SHOULD_ work, but I cannot be 100% sure, never tried those in particular... it is just to explain the principle of this method... that you should give it a go... it's not such a great expense. Please note that if you want a pass through usb video grabber (useful for example to grab games) you have to spend a bit (5xtimes!) more for a device with input _and_ real time output.
While my HDV camera supports HDMI video out, I wonder if TV HDMI ports do that as I have really never tested it.
The camera does output, the TV only INPUT. No luck.
(At least my HD PVRK could not record HDTV via the HDMI cable, only a limited format from the antenna cable. Analog VCR could record SD video via SCART or S-video adapter)
Yes of course.
3. If HDMI video out works, what type of digital signal is expected (format uncompressed and chroma level?)?
HDMI output works only through adapters, see above..
And if works, it has to be recorded as compressed (lossless) on the Linux PC? Among other 4:3 aspect ratio from analog SD video has to be taken care of.
One usually grabs with maximum quality one can afford and only _after_ grabbing thinks about compression. That is the way to preserve much of the original quality. -- Saluton, Marco Ciampa
Den 12.10.2021 08:44, skrev Marco Ciampa via Cin:
The thing is: the analog to digital converters _and_ the digital grabbers inside cheap pal/ntsc to usb2 are a crap. If you want a really good quality conversion you have to open wide your wallet and buy a really expensive grabber just to be sure that it has inside a good (but not so expensive in itself) analog to digital converter.
... or use a cheap external one like this (just an example):
https://www.amazon.com/ZHIYUEN-Adapter-Universal-Converter-Consumption/dp/B0...
More documentation is needed ;) The requirement was 8-bit color depth and video format (sampling) 4:2:2 throughout the workflow. The SCART to HDMI A/D converters I've searched fast on so far had missing information about this (just like the S-video&composite to usb2 converters/grabbers)
and to capture use one of these:
https://www.amazon.com/IPXOZO-Video-Capture-Card-USB/dp/B08YRWB7VD
The sample grabber supports Video output format: YUV420/JPEG and video format 8/10/12bit Deep color (?) --------------- Terje J. H
these are just examples, (I do not work for Amazon! ;-) I picked them randomly and they _SHOULD_ work, but I cannot be 100% sure, never tried those in particular... it is just to explain the principle of this method... that you should give it a go... it's not such a great expense.
Please note that if you want a pass through usb video grabber (useful for example to grab games) you have to spend a bit (5xtimes!) more for a device with input _and_ real time output.
On Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 10:21:09PM +0200, Terje J. Hanssen via Cin wrote:
Den 12.10.2021 08:44, skrev Marco Ciampa via Cin:
The thing is: the analog to digital converters _and_ the digital grabbers inside cheap pal/ntsc to usb2 are a crap. If you want a really good quality conversion you have to open wide your wallet and buy a really expensive grabber just to be sure that it has inside a good (but not so expensive in itself) analog to digital converter.
... or use a cheap external one like this (just an example):
https://www.amazon.com/ZHIYUEN-Adapter-Universal-Converter-Consumption/dp/B0...
More documentation is needed ;) The requirement was 8-bit color depth and video format (sampling) 4:2:2 throughout the workflow. The SCART to HDMI A/D converters I've searched fast on so far had missing information about this
1) It was just an example... 2) If you search you will find... 3) It's only ~8 euros, just grab one and try and thanks to Amazon, you have 1 month to give it back if that does't work or suites you. Other on-line shops may have similar return policies...
(just like the S-video&composite to usb2 converters/grabbers)
did I already say (I suggest you to...) _DO NOT BUY_ inexpensive S-video/composite grabbers?
and to capture use one of these:
https://www.amazon.com/IPXOZO-Video-Capture-Card-USB/dp/B08YRWB7VD
The sample grabber supports Video output format: YUV420/JPEG and video format 8/10/12bit Deep color (?)
I repeat: that was just an example, as a proof of concept, but in this instance, yes, I read from the site (as you may have done already): Specifications: - HDMI resolution: Max input 4K 60Hz - Video output resolution: Max output 1920×1080@30Hz - Video output format: YUV420/JPEG - Support video format: 8/10/12bit Deep color - Support audio format: L-PCM - Support AWG26 HDMI standard cable: input up to 10 meters etc.
---------------
Terje J. H
these are just examples, (I do not work for Amazon! ;-) I picked them randomly and they _SHOULD_ work, but I cannot be 100% sure, never tried those in particular... it is just to explain the principle of this method... that you should give it a go... it's not such a great expense.
Please note that if you want a pass through usb video grabber (useful for example to grab games) you have to spend a bit (5xtimes!) more for a device with input _and_ real time output.
Did I say that is was just an example? ;-) -- Saluton, Marco Ciampa
participants (7)
-
Andrew Randrianasulu -
Dominique Michel -
Marco Ciampa -
mat -
mnieuw＠zap.a2000.nl
-
Stefan de Konink -
Terje J. Hanssen