[Cin] SD 16:9 missing among CinGG BD-Render Video Formats
Terje J. Hanssen
terjejhanssen at gmail.com
Thu Jan 18 16:56:24 CET 2024
Den 17.01.2024 19:59, skrev Andrew Randrianasulu:
>
>
> ср, 17 янв. 2024 г., 18:23 Terje J. Hanssen <terjejhanssen at gmail.com>:
>
>
>
> Den 17.01.2024 01:34, skrev Andrew Randrianasulu:
>>
>>
>> ср, 17 янв. 2024 г., 03:07 Terje J. Hanssen via Cin
>> <cin at lists.cinelerra-gg.org>:
>>
>>
>>
>> Den 16.01.2024 17:53, skrev Andrea paz:
>> >> I just installed the latest cin-x86_64 AppImage, started
>> as root, loaded a HDV clip to test to create a BD
>> iso/structure, without Blu-ray device connected (similar like
>> testing create DVD).
>> >> But I got the following error message; any idea what is
>> wrong here?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I think BD-Render currently is locked to AVCHD (h264)
>> video and ac3 audio only.
>> > The same mistake I had. To do a BD/DVD render we need to
>> run CinGG
>> > with root permissions.
>>
>> Well, maybe you saw I actually had root access, but tried
>> instead to
>> write to a directory I had renamed 😳
>> >
>> > @Terje
>> > Thanks for the corrections. I put the new version of the
>> text for the
>> > manual (the third part). Can you check this as well?
>>
>> Seems fine for me.
>>
>> > Plus I would like
>> > to ask you if you could add a "Use Case" for BDs, since I
>> have no
>> > knowledge of it....
>>
>> Yes, let us co-operate on a BD use case next, but first I
>> suggest to
>> complete the 16:9 HDV to 16:9 DV use case successful ;)
>>
>>
>> well, may be just use DVD render but abort it at second
>> (batchrender) window, and render normally ?
>>
>> if dvd render set scaler automatically you hopefully just can
>> reuse its settings for wide dv encoding?
>>
>> but watch out for interlace reversal ... :( (tff for hdv, bff for
>> dv).
>>
>
>
> Yes, I think that can do the trick. I got it to work, but I hope
> this workaround can be more plain and clearly, if it is possible
> to "copy" the DVD Scale button in some way to the File Render window.
>
> I felt I had not completely control over what happened.
>
>
>
> Heh :) In this case you hopefully can just save scale plugin/effect
> setting as they set up by DVD wizard for your case and then just
> manually apply effect over whole video track and set its parameters
> from profile? Even without GUI you can copy xml file from .bcast5
> directory to your favorite place and then copy ot back when you need
> to render with those specific parameters again. Sort of settings template
>
Could you think of making a couple of CinGG demo videos to manual, for
the following use cases:
1) Rendering HD(V) to 16x9 SD-DV (anamorhic down-conversion with
oversampling)
2) Rendering HD(V) to 16x9 DVD video
3) Rendering 16x9 DV to 16x9 DVD video
Another, very illustrative reference I will suggest to this manual topic(s):
https://www.sandelinmedia.com/widescreen/
>
> By the way, here is the procedure I think did work for me:
>
> 1. Loaded the HDV
> 2. Started File > DVD Render, selected Format: PAL (25.00) 16x9,
> Scale: Scaled, and OK
> 3. Batch (DVD) Render window opens
> 4. Started File > Render and closed the Batch Render window
> 5. Edited file path and file name, File Format: FFmpeg - avi (or
> dv), Audio: Preset avi_pcm, Video: dv_pal.avi, and before OK!
> 6. Open Set Format, verify the Canvas size has changed to 720x576
> and DAR 16:9, Switch Interlace mode to: Bottom Field First, OK
> 7. Lastly OK on the Render Window (5) and rendering begin
>
> Confusingly 2. and 3 partly may create DVD directories which can
> be deleted.
>
>
>
> yeah, this is just workaround. I do not feel very comfortable doing
> GUI work, and I do not feel special-casing workflow into generic
> rendering window will be good idea...
Well, in principle I prefer to utilize and combine the best of both
worlds, complementary when possible. GUI for visual overview, easy
accessibility of non-familiar testing or new features/applications. CLI
for effectivity, and understanding when experience, yes. When I started
with CPM/DOS and Unix and Uniplex, the most were CLI based.
>
> Tried both TFF and BFF
> The bottom line is that this trick and workaround created DV 16x9
> files which all displayed correct due to [SAR 64;45 and DAR 16:9] 😎
>
>
> but do they display smooth motion? I am still worried about field
> dominance :)
>
>
>
> ffprobe -hide_banner dv07_05_wide_cingg.avi
> Input #0, avi, from 'dv07_05_wide_cingg.avi':
> Metadata:
> software : Lavf60.16.100
> Duration: 00:06:58.04, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 30342 kb/s
> Stream #0:0: Video: dvvideo (dvsd / 0x64737664), yuv420p,
> 720x576 [SAR 64:45 DAR 16:9], 28802 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbr, 25
> tbn, 25 tbc
> Stream #0:1: Audio: pcm_s16le ([1][0][0][0] / 0x0001), 48000
> Hz, 2 channels, s16, 1536 kb/s
>
> mediainfo dv07_05_wide_cingg.avi | grep Scan
> Scan type : Interlaced
> Scan order : Top Field First
>
>
> ffprobe -hide_banner dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.avi
> Input #0, avi, from 'dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.avi':
> Metadata:
> software : Lavf60.16.100
> Duration: 00:06:58.04, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 30342 kb/s
> Stream #0:0: Video: dvvideo (dvsd / 0x64737664), yuv420p,
> 720x576 [SAR 64:45 DAR 16:9], 28802 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbr, 25
> tbn, 25 tbc
> Stream #0:1: Audio: pcm_s16le ([1][0][0][0] / 0x0001), 48000
> Hz, 2 channels, s16, 1536 kb/s
>
> mediainfo dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.avi | grep Scan
> Scan type : Interlaced
> Scan order : Bottom Field First
>
>
> ffprobe -hide_banner dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.dv
> [dv @ 0x55b67a8e1580] Estimating duration from bitrate, this
> may be inaccurate
> Input #0, dv, from 'dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.dv':
> Metadata:
> timecode : 00:00:00:00
> Duration: 00:06:58.04, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 28800 kb/s
> Stream #0:0: Video: dvvideo, yuv420p, 720x576 [SAR 64:45 DAR
> 16:9], 25000 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbr, 25 tbn, 25 tbc
> Stream #0:1: Audio: pcm_s16le, 48000 Hz, stereo, s16, 1536 kb/s
>
> mediainfo dv_16x9_cingg_20240117.dv | grep Scan
> Scan type : Interlaced
> Scan order : Top Field First
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> So may be you need more complex hdv interlaced = to frames ->
>> scale down fields independently = > encode
>>
>> procedure ....
>> https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/CinelerraGG_Manual/480.html
>>
>>
>> If you just deinterlace then scale it will be simpler, i think.
>> Because we not start with upscaled interlaced SD ....
>>
>>
>>
>> To repeat and extract from the long thread, we can start from
>> from my
>> dialog with Andrew below:
>> https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/pipermail/cin/2024-January/007699.html
>>
>> =================
>> > I wonder how much was cropped?
>> >
>> > May be I misread you but you loaded HDV 1440*1080 clip and
>> then
>> > rendered it into ffmpeg DV at 576i WITHOUT any scaling on top?
>> >
>> --------------------
>> Yes, I loaded the anamorphic 16:9 HDV 1440x1080 clip and then
>> rendered
>> it using Set Format Preset PAL 576i (16:9)-DV(D) - without
>> any scaling
>> on top.
>> According to my understanding this should down-convert the
>> full source
>> image to DVD 16:9 anamorphic format, which at playback should
>> display
>> upscaled 16:9 screen.
>> That is, just as in my first post
>>
>> 4 b) FFmpeg transcode HDV to DV-wide
>> ffmpeg -hide_banner -i hdv07_05.m2t -vf
>> scale=720:576,setsar=64/45,setdar=16/9 -c:v dvvideo -c:a
>> pcm_s16le
>> dv07_05_wide.dv
>> ----------------------------
>> DVD Render Format autoscales the input HDV format to fit the
>> selected
>> 16x9 DVD output format.
>> When input format and output rendering formats are identical,
>> it seems
>> that nothing needs to be set/edited manually in Set Format.
>>
>> Then the unavoidable request/suggestion:
>> Could correspondingly different I/O format via selected
>> Presets also
>> bake in Autoscale as default (beside color space mentioned
>> before) ?
>> (refer to the: -vf scale=720:576,setsar=64/45,setdar=16/9 in
>> the ffmpeg
>> line below)
>> ---------------------------
>> I think no, it was intended to give users control over what
>> kind of
>> filters they want to apply. Even with ffmpeg you still
>> manually add
>> scale filter ...
>> -----------------------------
>> Fx. the DVD Render window has a Scale dropdown menu, where
>> "Scaled" is
>> default.
>> The other options are None and Cropped (various).
>> As an additional test I rendered with None, and then got
>> similar 16:9
>> output displayed as ffmpeg-avi.
>> (The Raw DV differed with 4_3 display)
>> ============
>>
>> Here we are currently. I hoped to get this
>> down-convert/scale Rendering
>> via Set Format Preset as easy as corresponding DVD Render (and
>> BD-Render) using a user selectable "Scale switch". If this is
>> not easy,
>> possible or desirable, I hope you can add the detailed Scale
>> steps in
>> this case from here, because I have no experience with this yet.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cin mailing list
>> Cin at lists.cinelerra-gg.org
>> https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/mailman/listinfo/cin
>>
>
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