April 2025 - Cin - Cinelerra-GG Mailing Lists

Final Cut Pro goes to 120-125% in its scope tools
by Andrew Randrianasulu 17 Apr '25

17 Apr '25

https://i.ibb.co/whgznbHg/Screen-Shot-2025-04-17-at-17-37-47.png So *I think* internally it allows some under/overshots, and their visual monitoring. see for example also this vid (seems that back in 2011 shape for secondary CC was limited TO round corner rectangle/ellipse) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fx-frNPALk0 Here it differs from DaVinci Resolve scopes ....

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Adobe Premiere (2021) and HDR
by Andrew Randrianasulu 17 Apr '25

17 Apr '25

was looking at how exactly HDR info travels in production environment. https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-beta-discussions/discuss-color-… ===== Francis-Crossman Adobe Employee Sep 17, 2021 This expands the list of color managed codecs. H264/HEVC represents the majority of DSLR and mirrorless prosumer cameras on the market, and XAVC-L / XAVC Slog are heavily used in broadcast HDR workflows. “Color managed” means that Premiere Pro read the color tags in the file metadata and accurately converts the file to the sequence color space. If the color spaces of the file and sequence are the same, the Premiere Pro passes the colors through to the sequence without conversion. Color management is necessary for HDR production. Codecs that are not color managed will always be interpreted as Rec709, which worked just fine for a long time. But with HDR becoming more and more mainstream, proper color management is necessary. Full list of color managed codecs Codec Wrapper Color Space New? Apple ProRes · 422 HQ · 4444 · 4444 XQ .MOV Rec. 709 Rec. 2100 HLG Rec. 2100 PQ Previously supported Sony XAVC-I (all intra) .MXF Rec. 709 Rec. 2100 HLG Previously supported Sony XAVC-L (long GOP) .MXF Rec. 709 Rec. 2100 HLG NEW H.264 / HEVC (H.264) .MP4, .MOV Rec. 709 Rec. 2100 HLG Rec. 2100 PQ NEW ===== so in this case he talked about importing colorspace-tagged material, not embedded icc or display side. x264 support for XVAC-intra + HDR metadata was merged few years ago: https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1950549 https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1940382 https://code.videolan.org/videolan/x264/-/merge_requests/5 I still wonder how you get those values for mastering display? G(x,y)B(x,y)R(x,y)WP(x,y)L(max,min) hm may be like here, vua libdisplayinfo/EDID https://github.com/doitsujin/dxvk/blob/master/src/wsi/wsi_edid.cpp#L14 from https://github.com/libsdl-org/SDL/issues/6587 but ofc there us dev blog saying edid can be incomplete/inaccurate: https://planet.kde.org/xavers-blog-2024-05-10-hdr-and-color-management-in-k… ==== There is a fourth option though: Use the color information from the display’s EDID. In Plasma 6.1, you can simply select this in the display settings. color profile settings Note that it comes with some caveats too: the EDID only describes colors with the default display settings, so if you change the “picture mode” or similar things in the display settings, the values may not be correct anymore the manufacturer may not measure every panel and just put generic values for the display model into the EDID the manufacturer may put completely wrong values in there (which is why this is disabled by default) even when correct values are provided, ICC profiles have much more detailed information on the display’s behavior than the EDID can contain ==== but at least this round of search shows that SDL(2.x, 3?) does have some support for HDR now, so may be it also an option!

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Avid secondary color correction.
by Andrew Randrianasulu 17 Apr '25

17 Apr '25

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ANYSVEh2QOE "Avid Online Learning — Media Composer: Secondary Color Grading" around 30 min. You can see more specialized tools, but also basic shapes used.

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bunch of HDR related books
by Andrew Randrianasulu 17 Apr '25

17 Apr '25

Someone posted 92 mb zip of some 2015-2017 era reading material for this new 'HDR' thing. May be you can find original link on doom9 but here is copy, hopefully: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SCIqdqM4ZNBpN02zxmGe1hchpVUyqgcr/view?usp=…

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Secondary color correction in Blender 2.64
by Andrew Randrianasulu 17 Apr '25

17 Apr '25

Found this post from 2012 https://blenderartists.org/t/selective-secondary-color-correction-using-ble… ===== browneditor Nov 2012 Which color node allows direct selective secondary color correction in blender. I create group nodes with hsv keyer to color balance with a blur node to soften the range selection. It is very tedious to keep tabbing in to make small changes. please check my attachments to see if I am going in the right direction or not. [...] blendercomp <https://blenderartists.org/u/blendercomp> Nov 2012 <https://blenderartists.org/t/selective-secondary-color-correction-using-ble…> @Browneditor <https://blenderartists.org/u/browneditor>: ideally, you would want to use masks for secondary corrections. If you can easily pull a matte from your plates and use that as a mask then that’s really cool. In this case, I’d go for a mask, they’re easy to setup and animate in 2.64. If you insist on keying to create masks automatically, then it should be possible to derive a few masks by combining 3 or 4 color key nodes. Just play around with different ranges of hues per color key node and multiply the resulting mattes to combine then into a single one to control the area of interest. ==== quote end ==== there is also video note for KDENLIVE https://www.reddit.com/r/kdenlive/comments/1awa50b/kdenlive_secondary_color… original documentation for cin-HV notes: http://heroinewarrior.com/cinelerra/cinelerra.html 12.2 MASKS Masks define a region of the video to either set opaque or transparent. Another thing the mask tool does is draw paths. Paths are lines while masks are areas. Paths can be simple line drawings or outlines. Masks can be used in conjunction with another effect to isolate the effect to a certain region of the frame. A copy of one video track may be delayed slightly and unmasked in locations where the one copy has interference but the other copy doesn’t. Color correction may be needed in one section of a frame but not another. A mask can be applied to just a section of the color corrected track while the vanilla track shows through. Removal of boom microphones, airplanes, and housewives are other mask uses. The order of the compositing pipeline affects what can be done with masks. Mainly, masks are performed on the temporary after effects and before the projector. This means multiple tracks can be bounced to a masked track and projected with the same mask. ==== *I think* Blue Banana documentation mention internal to plugin mask you can use for masking out specific color/color ranges, but not sure how you use it for such case? Are we supposed to build 3 new track versions for low/mid/high correction?

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offtopic: digital cinema in avisynth
by Andrew Randrianasulu 16 Apr '25

16 Apr '25

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1993514 "*The Ultimate Avisynth DCP (Digital Cinema Package) creation guide"* a bit complicated (and using Windows version of programs) but apparently working up to now ;) nearly 1Tb of space used for 50 min documentary and some HEAVY cpu machine for motionjpeg2000 encoding .....

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Fwd: [FFmpeg-devel] Libtheora encoder/cingg <->ffmpeg interop?
by Andrew Randrianasulu 15 Apr '25

15 Apr '25

---------- Forwarded message --------- От: James Almer <jamrial(a)gmail.com> Date: пн, 14 апр. 2025 г., 02:56 Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] Libtheora encoder/cingg <->ffmpeg interop? To: <ffmpeg-devel(a)ffmpeg.org> On 4/13/2025 8:52 PM, Andrew Randrianasulu wrote: > I was testing our libtheora encoder/muxer after updating to libtheora 1.2.0 > and noticed that ffmpeg complains about "(non)keyframe not correctly marked" Backporting commit 22aa71d4da37a4ad2b0d28deeace64b57aa2ef50 to the 7.1 branch should fix it. ===== I think this mean we better to stick to libtheora-1..1.1 until ffmpeg fix propagates? May be add just postprocessing fix so build with system's libtheora (possibly 1.2.0 in near future as Arch and termux move to bleeding edge) will not break it visually? It sort of sad that seemingly stable library update (one in 15 years) resulted in this ..... _______________________________________________ ffmpeg-devel mailing list ffmpeg-devel(a)ffmpeg.org https://ffmpeg.org/mailman/listinfo/ffmpeg-devel To unsubscribe, visit link above, or email ffmpeg-devel-request(a)ffmpeg.org with subject "unsubscribe".

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Two links on ICC in MP4
by Andrew Randrianasulu 14 Apr '25

14 Apr '25

Starter thread, at least back in time (2022) it was not easy/possible to use ffmpeg for adding custom icc profile to mp4 container but MP4Box from gpac project was up to task: https://superuser.com/questions/1739082/embedding-a-custom-icc-profile-in-a… ===== Creating MP4 video without ICC profile (for testing): ffmpeg -y -loop 1 -framerate 1 -i icc_chelsea.png -vcodec libx265 -t 10 chelsea.mp4 Extracting the ICC profile: magick icc_chelsea.png profile.icc Adding the ICC profile to the MP4 video file using MP4Box: MP4Box -add video.mp4#video:colr=prof,profile.icc -new icc_video.mp4 Testing with FFprobe: ffprobe icc_chelsea.mp4 ===== end of quotation ==== As far as I understand in this case idea was to embed display profile into media. But few apps outside of Final Cut Pro/quicktime can do anything useful about this info? https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=129232.0 this one from ~2019. It states that instead of more flexible color management video world used few fixed mode monitor color spaces, and whole process was a bit manual if your input image/video was not in one of those. I think we hit crudest form of this limitation when we try to fade titler's text over png image. It sort of flashes, due to missing (unapplied) 2.4 gamma step?

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Libtheora encoder/cingg <->ffmpeg interop?
by Andrew Randrianasulu 13 Apr '25

13 Apr '25

I was testing our libtheora encoder/muxer after updating to libtheora 1.2.0 and noticed that ffmpeg complains about "(non)keyframe not correctly marked" ~/cinelerra/cinelerra-5.1 $ ffmpeg -i ~/svt_t.ogg -f null /dev/null ffmpeg version 7.1.1 Copyright (c) 2000-2025 the FFmpeg developers built with Android (12470979, +pgo, +bolt, +lto, +mlgo, based on r522817c) clang version 18.0.3 ( https://android.googlesource.com/toolchain/llvm-project d8003a456d14a3deb8054cdaa529ffbf02d9b262) configuration: --arch=aarch64 --as=aarch64-linux-android-clang --cc=aarch64-linux-android-clang --cxx=aarch64-linux-android-clang++ --nm=llvm-nm --ar=llvm-ar --ranlib=llvm-ranlib --pkg-config=/home/builder/.termux-build/_cache/android-r27c-api-24-v1/bin/pkg-config --strip=llvm-strip --cross-prefix=aarch64-linux-android- --disable-indevs --disable-outdevs --enable-indev=lavfi --disable-static --disable-symver --enable-cross-compile --enable-gnutls --enable-gpl --enable-version3 --enable-jni --enable-lcms2 --enable-libaom --enable-libass --enable-libbluray --enable-libdav1d --enable-libfontconfig --enable-libfreetype --enable-libfribidi --enable-libgme --enable-libharfbuzz --enable-libmp3lame --enable-libopencore-amrnb --enable-libopencore-amrwb --enable-libopenmpt --enable-libopus --enable-librav1e --enable-librubberband --enable-libsoxr --enable-libsrt --enable-libssh --enable-libsvtav1 --enable-libtheora --enable-libv4l2 --enable-libvidstab --enable-libvmaf --enable-libvo-amrwbenc --enable-libvorbis --enable-libvpx --enable-libwebp --enable-libx264 --enable-libx265 --enable-libxml2 --enable-libxvid --enable-libzimg --enable-libzmq --enable-mediacodec --enable-opencl --enable-shared --prefix=/data/data/com.termux/files/usr --target-os=android --extra-libs=-landroid-glob --disable-vulkan --enable-neon --disable-libfdk-aac libavutil 59. 39.100 / 59. 39.100 libavcodec 61. 19.101 / 61. 19.101 libavformat 61. 7.100 / 61. 7.100 libavdevice 61. 3.100 / 61. 3.100 libavfilter 10. 4.100 / 10. 4.100 libswscale 8. 3.100 / 8. 3.100 libswresample 5. 3.100 / 5. 3.100 libpostproc 58. 3.100 / 58. 3.100 [ogg @ 0xb40000710c40f4d0] Broken file, keyframe not correctly marked. Input #0, ogg, from '/data/data/com.termux/files/home/svt_t.ogg': Duration: 00:00:13.44, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 658 kb/s Stream #0:0: Video: theora, yuv420p(bt470bg/bt470bg/bt709), 1440x1080 [SAR 1333333:1000000 DAR 888894:500003], 25 tbr, 25 tbn Metadata: ENCODER : Cinelerra Infinity Stream mapping: Stream #0:0 -> #0:0 (theora (native) -> wrapped_avframe (native)) Press [q] to stop, [?] for help Output #0, null, to '/dev/null': Metadata: encoder : Lavf61.7.100 Stream #0:0: Video: wrapped_avframe, yuv420p(bt470bg/bt470bg/bt709, progressive), 1440x1080 [SAR 1333333:1000000 DAR 888894:500003], q=2-31, 200 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbn Metadata: encoder : Lavc61.19.101 wrapped_avframe [ogg @ 0xb40000710c40f4d0] Broken file, keyframe not correctly marked. [ogg @ 0xb40000710c40f4d0] Broken file, keyframe not correctly marked.=8.24x Last message repeated 1 times [ogg @ 0xb40000710c40f4d0] Broken file, non-keyframe not correctly marked. Last message repeated 36 times [ogg @ 0xb40000710c40f4d0] Broken file, non-keyframe not correctly marked.9x Last message repeated 58 times [out#0/null @ 0xb4000070bc40f7f0] video:144KiB audio:0KiB subtitle:0KiB other streams:0KiB global headers:0KiB muxing overhead: unknown frame= 336 fps=264 q=-0.0 Lsize=N/A time=00:00:13.44 bitrate=N/A speed=10.6x I found this recent bug on libtheora gitlab, not sure if last comment is true or misses something when it comes to ffmpeg? https://gitlab.xiph.org/xiph/theora/-/issues/2311 some other search hits: https://progress.opensuse.org/issues/42047 https://github.com/Enselic/recordmydesktop/issues/23

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Some changes for testing purposes for clipping and speed
by Phyllis Smith 13 Apr '25

13 Apr '25

An x86 AppImage for older Operating Systems AND with the alternative shortcut set is at: https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/testing/cin-x86_alternative.AppImage Hoping *IgorBeghetto* might get a chance to test this weekend. Changes included are for - Blur plugin should prevent clipping (Andrea has tested successfully) - Title plugin should prevent clipping (Andrea has tested successfully) - Because BT #672 (https://www.cinelerra-gg.org/bugtracker/view.php?id=672) was fixed without real understanding of the underlying problem, testing of Speed and especially Bump Autos (which is what I think that the original blunder fix addressed) would be helpful. Explanation of Bump Autos is still online at: https://cinelerra-gg.org/download/testing/bump_autos.pdf Feedback welcome. Thanks, Phyllis

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